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Thread: NXT

  1. #161
    The Brain
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    Man, that card actually does look really awesome, and I say that as a guy who isn't always excited about Takeover like some are. There's really only one match I'm not interested in.

  2. #162
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    So...is Sam Shaw working an American Psycho kind of gimmick? This is giving me that sort of vibe.

    https://www.instagram.com/wwenxt/p/B...=1ehh7v4wqno1e

  3. #163
    The Brain
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    I mean he was shamefully ripping off Dexter when he worked TNA, so at least he's staying in the same genre.

  4. #164
    WALTER vs. Dunne is set for Takeover before Wrestlemania. Takeover is going to be fun.

  5. #165
    The Brain
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    That match is seriously going to rock. Excited for more people getting exposed to the greatness that is WALTER.

  6. #166
    Oliver asked what you're looking forward to for Wrestlemania, so I'll ask what are you looking forward to at Takeover?

    The easy answer would be everything but Walter/Dunn I think are going to steal the show. I still haven't seen a ton of Walter matches so I'm excited to see a proper match with Dunn.

    Dream-Riddle is a very interesting match too. Does Riddle take the title and Dream goes after the NXT Title? It's hard to see Riddle losing here but I want Dream to keep winning as well.

    The women's match is the one I'm least interested but it still has a good possibility of being highly entertaining.

  7. #167
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    WALTER vs Dunne very much has the potential to be the match of the weekend, if not the WWE year so far.

    Broadly I agree with you, numb - the women's match could be a mess but could also be excellent given who's in there. Dream-Riddle, to be honest I'd go with Riddle taking a loss because I want to see Dream grow that title a little more, and I think Riddle could be excellent in the main event picture down the line, and probably far more so than Dream immediately after Takeover.

    Gargano vs Cole, if nothing goes wrong in the execution, probably has a minimum level of 4.5/5 in terms of just enjoyment of excellent wrestling. Somebody I read regularly on NXT has seen them have half an hour at a house show and says it was incredible. Also, NXT does 2/3 falls matches tremendously well, as a rule.

  8. #168
    The Brain
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    I really like the whole card, aside from Gargano/Cole, and I'm sure I'm in the minority there. I just can't get into Cole.

    I also can't unsee that someone posted on Twitter than Gargano and all 4 UE guys look like the exact same person with 5 different haircuts/beards.

  9. #169
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    You know that I'm in the same boat as you on Cole, Mizfan, but he (like Gargano) has one hundred percent benefited by being in the WWE system.

    I wouldn't have said either could even be in consideration for my favourite current wrestler pre-NXT, and while neither is there now either because i) they still have some stylistic issues, ii) they both tend to slightly overwork the problem, and iii) Pentagon Jr and Tomohiro Ishii still exist, I would certainly say they are much better wrestlers now than they were before.

    EDIT: OK, so watching NXT this week and, like...who the hell looked at Gunner in TNA and thought 'that's our dude'? And who keeps doing it? I didn't think it was possible for anybody to have a bad match with Oney Lorcan, but Jaxon Ryker's gone out there and done it.
    Last edited by Oliver; 04-05-2019 at 07:12 AM.

  10. #170
    Been a pretty good show thus far. Surprised that Dream retained over Riddle and ended his undefeated streak, tbh.

  11. #171
    HUGE Member TheLAW's Avatar
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    That main event is everything that bugs me about modern pro wrestling. False finishes are the worst trope in the book. Overused and they don't heighten the story at all. They just make finishes look weak as fuck. A 199 pound man just kicked out of 7 moves that should have killed most wrestlers including a FUCKING Canadian Destroyer and a double team. Fucking stupid.
    Last edited by TheLAW; 04-06-2019 at 02:01 AM.

  12. #172
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    Hallelujah!!! Exactly what I’ve been saying on twitter and yet I’m trolling? Gargano has entered the realms of Taker, Cena, Roman and become Super Gargano. The 2/3 falls match type is a shit match in general cause it’s hard to book. But for ALL the thing he kicked out of in his matches with Ciampa he loses the first fall after Cole’s knee to the back of the head after basically no other big moves? It’s ridiculous. Not to mention what Law said above. I get it’s a 2/3 falls match and the last fall should be the most exciting, which as I said is why they are hard to book and why I loathe them, but he loses fall 1 that easily but is then kicking out of O’Reilly and Fish’s double team move immediately followed by a superkick, superkick to the back of the head and then immediately Cole’s knee to the back of the head? It’s just head shaking. How can Gargano ever lose a match on the main roster with everything he kicks out of?

  13. #173
    HUGE Member TheLAW's Avatar
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    They're actually not that hard to book. Problem is they don't utilize the old 3 stages of hell idea. Even without that though. First fall goes ten minutes and ends with a lucky win, not a finish. Second fall should be almost the same but with your typical shenanigans. Knocked out ref, interference. Etc. Goes to a tie. Third fall has one.... Maybe... But ONE false finish but it should be by the heel if you're gonna use it at all. But, signature moves, submissions and title belts are all fair game this round. Side note: if you use the belt shot, the victim doesn't reverse the following finish like WWE 2K19 LOL.

  14. #174
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    I'm just happy that other people now know about WALTER.

  15. #175
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    I actually disagree with the above on the main, I think they did everything right in terms of bell to bell execution, and having the interference and ref bump in the final fall was spot on. That last fall was absolutely molten for that reason, and it really worked well as a result.

    I get that they went overboard a little bit on the near falls - I said above that both Cole and Gargano overwork the problem and that's basically what I'm saying. That said, the issue isn't just them, it's the fact that people don't develop any secondary moves as potential finishers. Like, other than the Last Shot, has Cole got a win with anything else in NXT? Because if not does anybody buy any other move than the Last Shot as getting a fall? And if that's the case - is the crowd going to engage with near falls from anything else?

    They're kind of between the devil and the deep blue sea on it, in a way. For what it's worth, I completely bought into the entire thing, bell to bell. The only thing I didn't really like in the whole match was immediately after the first fall, from the Last Shot, Cole hit a second one and Gargano kicked out. That seemed a bit jarring

  16. #176
    I was sucked in to the main event too. I do think they could tone down all the kicks to the head, but at the same time what’s wrong with accepting that athletes can elevate their game and take more punishment on a grand stage? Happens all the time in athletic competition.

    I liked the story of the Dream-Riddle match. Dream took a beating but escaped with the gold.

    And WALTER is a fucking beast.

  17. #177
    I don't have a problem with false finishes. It adds drama, besides if 1 finisher was all that was required to win, then it would be anticlimactic.

  18. #178
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    Quote Originally Posted by comfortablynumb View Post
    I liked the story of the Dream-Riddle match. Dream took a beating but escaped with the gold.
    I loved that match. Like, the whole unspoken character thing is that Dream and Riddle are almost one and the same, but channel that energy in different ways. Like, they're both basically just idiots with differing levels of self-awareness - Riddle has no self-awareness, Dream has all the self-awareness.

    I love that Dream, in a world full of ever evolving complexity, diving tiger twisting crossbodies and complex mat wrestling nonsense, is the most simplistic 1980s wrestler ever. Back rakes, double axe handles, elbow drops...there's nothing difficult about his wrestling.

    He's going to be a main eventer in the future, and it's going to absolutely rule.

  19. #179
    Administrator Prime Time's Avatar
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    Anyone checked out Kushida's debut yet?

    "The worst moron is the one too stupid to realise they're a moron."

  20. #180
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    ^ Two weeks on and I still haven't got to it.

    The Takeover at the start of June looks like it could be really good.

    Johnny Gargano vs Adam Cole for the NXT Championship
    Velveteen Dream vs Tyler Breeze(!!!) for the North American Championship
    Shayna Baszler vs Io Shirai for the NXT Women's Championship
    The Undisputed Era vs The Forgotten Sons vs Oney and Twoey vs The Street Profits in a ladder match for the NXT Tag Titles

    I'm not completely sure why they're going back to Cole vs Gargano (I get the storyline reasons for it, just don't think it's a match that's needed again, especially after going 2/3 falls on Mania weekend) but it should be a good match again and hey, Davey Meltface gave it 5.5 stars last time so I'm sure he's happy to watch it again.

    Otherwise, that card is looking ace. I'm really hyped to see what Montez Ford can do in a ladder match.

  21. #181
    The Brain
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    Shayna Baszler and Io Shirai had a match that absolutely killed in Stardom 2 years ago. Hope they can do it again!

  22. #182
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    No spoilers, but I love NXT and it is a precious baby rainbow in a cloudy sky.

  23. #183
    Transgender Terror
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    No that's me.

  24. #184
    Kyle O’Rielly took a beating in that tag match. Montez Ford has star quality.

  25. #185
    this NxT blew AEW out of the water. So much quality.

  26. #186
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    Quote Originally Posted by comfortablynumb View Post
    Kyle O’Rielly took a beating in that tag match. Montez Ford has star quality.
    How weird is it that that match was the first time the Street Profits have been on a Takeover?

    Quote Originally Posted by T.O. View Post
    No that's me.
    This is also true.

  27. #187
    Super Moderator Team Farrell's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JacobWrestledGod View Post
    this NxT blew AEW out of the water. So much quality.
    Really? Wow, I felt completely different. I thought that Dream vs Beeze was one of the worst matches I've seen on a mainstream show in a long time. Baszler vs Shirai was okay but sloppy at points and there was just too much in that main event. They did so much that it stopped being false finishes and became me wondering when this match was going to finally end.

    The ladder match and Riddle vs Roddy were really great.

    I'm finding a trend with these shows where you can really tell that all these people train together and you're getting everyone doing the same shit. There were a number of repeated sequences, for example enziguris to a guy on the top rope to cut them off. Everyone is wrestling the same.

    I think that a part of it is Undisputed Era guys being featured in three of the five matches and they were put together specifically because they were the indy star guys who worked similarly. But my god was everything so similar.

  28. #188
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    Quote Originally Posted by Team Farrell View Post
    The ladder match and Riddle vs Roddy were really great.
    I liked everything about the ladder match except for bloody Gunner turning up. More than just not being a fan of his, that match was really starting to shift through some gears and then he turned up and pretty much killed the momentum for 5 minutes or so.

  29. #189
    Puerto Rican dude living in Japan Degenerate's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Team Farrell View Post
    there was just too much in that main event. They did so much that it stopped being false finishes and became me wondering when this match was going to finally end.
    I read a few people joking that the only thing this match was missing was for Cole to pull out a gun, shoot Gargano point blank in the face, pin him, only for Gargano to still kick out at 2. It sure seemed that way. I enjoyed that match but there were way too many insane-looking spots that were kicked out of. It really lessened the impact of everything.

  30. #190
    Super Moderator Team Farrell's Avatar
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    How many times can you kick a guy in the head or drop him on his head and have him kick out?

    It's my problem with Takeover shows on the whole. Everyone goes out trying to put on a main event quality match, and all of a sudden nothing is left for the main event but to kick each others heads off over and over, pull up the ringside mat, or other smoke and mirrors.

    The shame is that they could have had a truly great encounter. The storytelling of Gargano having one bad leg while at the same time working on Cole's arm was great. And they used it to full advantage a few times. But then at the end it was finisher spam, superkicks, TWO destroyers and the Last Shot. I figured Gargano's worn down leg would play into the finish in some way, but it was just the Last Shot.

    After the Destroyer on the floor wasn't the finish, I pretty much checked out of the match.

  31. #191
    Administrator Prime Time's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Team Farrell View Post
    How many times can you kick a guy in the head or drop him on his head and have him kick out?.

    Surely the answer to this is once, and even that's pushing it?

    This is why kicks used to have to be with the sole of the foot to be legal, and frankly it does make everything that little bit more credible.

    "The worst moron is the one too stupid to realise they're a moron."

  32. #192
    I thought that Dream vs Beeze was one of the worst matches I've seen on a mainstream show in a long time.
    Why is that so? I don't understand why anyone would hate that match, with its near perfect execution, its strict adherence to not overplaying finishes, the character work of both men, the simple but effective ending, it was a perfect midcard/ upper card match for a championship and it shows. Watching it alongside Cody vs Dustin, I think the execution is better and while Cody vs Dustin has more emotional weight, with the blood and all, it's still an old man struggling at times during the match to keep up. Dream was amazing, and the match cemented both as top competitors of the future. For all the ocmplains about older stars, AEW uses Jericho, Omega and Dustin as their top billings, and that's a finger of shame from me honestly. Look, I love the PPV as much as I can, but Takeover is just too good to ignore.

  33. #193
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    On Cole/Gargano - I mean, I think I've said it on here before, but that's kind of what you get with them. I don't think it's a specific Cole/Gargano problem, understand, but I think both of them have done that style throughout their careers where others haven't, and as a result they know how to really work that finisher stuff in and make it work better.

    I didn't think the main was as good as everyone else seems to either, but I certainly didn't hate it. I did love Dream/Breeze, though, and think it worked really well.

    Hearing that Cole and Baszler are set to get called up soon. Would be a bit weird to see Cole called up without the rest of UE.

  34. #194
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    Quote Originally Posted by JacobWrestledGod View Post
    Why is that so? I don't understand why anyone would hate that match, with its near perfect execution, its strict adherence to not overplaying finishes, the character work of both men, the simple but effective ending, it was a perfect midcard/ upper card match for a championship and it shows. Watching it alongside Cody vs Dustin, I think the execution is better and while Cody vs Dustin has more emotional weight, with the blood and all, it's still an old man struggling at times during the match to keep up. Dream was amazing, and the match cemented both as top competitors of the future. For all the ocmplains about older stars, AEW uses Jericho, Omega and Dustin as their top billings, and that's a finger of shame from me honestly. Look, I love the PPV as much as I can, but Takeover is just too good to ignore.
    Curious how 35 year old Omega got lumped in with the older guys? And I'd hardly say Dustin is top billing for AEW, if he does much wrestling past the tag match with Cody I'll be surprised. Old man struggling to keep up was really the story he was trying to tell too, and I thought he executed it exactly the way he wanted/needed to. I do get some concern with Jericho but I think the difference is Jericho is legitimately killing it as a character right now and can still go in the ring, as opposed to a lot of the older guys who don't seem to care and/or can't perform too well anymore.

    I am surprised someone would call out Dream/Breeze as being particularly bad, I didn't check it out yet but on paper that sounds like it'd be quite fun.

  35. #195
    Super Moderator Team Farrell's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JacobWrestledGod View Post
    Why is that so? I don't understand why anyone would hate that match, with its near perfect execution, its strict adherence to not overplaying finishes, the character work of both men, the simple but effective ending, it was a perfect midcard/ upper card match for a championship and it shows. Watching it alongside Cody vs Dustin, I think the execution is better and while Cody vs Dustin has more emotional weight, with the blood and all, it's still an old man struggling at times during the match to keep up. Dream was amazing, and the match cemented both as top competitors of the future. For all the ocmplains about older stars, AEW uses Jericho, Omega and Dustin as their top billings, and that's a finger of shame from me honestly. Look, I love the PPV as much as I can, but Takeover is just too good to ignore.
    The formula might have been good, but its execution was poor. For a company with a Performance Centre that's got 95 rings in it, I don't expect to turn on a pay per view and see two guys wrestle like they'd never met. Shit, I've seen guys walk into a building a meet an hour before an event and have more chemistry.

    There's a fine line in pro wrestling between working together and making it look like you're working together, and everything falling apart because you are clearly not working (well) together, and that match fell firmly into the latter category. And it wasn't just little things, it was major issues. Breeze forgot (I assume) that he had to be down for the Elbow spot and threw a dropkick at nothing in the centre of the ring before Dream jumped. The commentators tried to cover it, but it was literally a dropkick at nothing 10 feet away from his opponent. The two were stumbling over each other for an entirely too long 17 minutes that felt like 45.

    Some guys just don't have that physical chemistry together, and I think it's clear that those two don't. They have great matches with other opponents, but just don't seem to gel together.

    That Takeover show just wasn't great. I haven't really enjoyed a Takeover card in a long time, and I'm a WWE fan.

    There were two awesome matches, one poor match, and alright women's match but as much as Baszler is improving on her fundamentals, she's still too green to be in that position, and they had a main event that got tedious by the end. Maybe Takeover needs to play with the format a little bit and start doing a sixth match. Not ever match needs to be bordering on 20 minutes.

    Shit, you could have taken ten minutes from the main event and five from Dream vs Breeze, had another decent length match on the card and saved both of those outings.

    Quote Originally Posted by mizfan View Post
    I am surprised someone would call out Dream/Breeze as being particularly bad, I didn't check it out yet but on paper that sounds like it'd be quite fun.
    Like I said, they just don't seem to have chemistry. That's not to take away from either guy, because I know what they're capable of, but sometimes guys are just physically oil and water.

  36. #196
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    Quote Originally Posted by Team Farrell View Post
    And it wasn't just little things, it was major issues. Breeze forgot (I assume) that he had to be down for the Elbow spot and threw a dropkick at nothing in the centre of the ring before Dream jumped.
    See, I didn't mind that because Dream had done the same thing a bit earlier in the match - I thought it was Breeze trying to preempt the move and throw a dropkick with Dream then stopping to second guess that happening. But I get it looked weird, because it did.

    Eh, it wasn't for you Coach, and that's cool. I liked it, but I get where you're coming from - it was a great TV match that they put on a PPV and stretched (slightly) for time. Unfortunately total run times of NXT events have started to edge towards 2.5 hours, when they only need to run to 2.

  37. #197
    If this crosses the line, oh well but at tonight’s taping Regal announced an eight-man NXT Breakout Tournament featuring only people who have yet to be on TV. Winners gets a title shot of his choosing. I think it’s a great idea.

  38. #198
    Transgender Terror
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    A similar idea gave us the initial Sheamus push so why not?

  39. #199
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    Quote Originally Posted by Team Farrell View Post
    That Takeover show just wasn't great. I haven't really enjoyed a Takeover card in a long time, and I'm a WWE fan.
    Could it be that the Takeover match formula (not the 5 20 minutes matches you also talked about) is wearing thin? It's something I'm sensing/predicting with the AEW/Young Bucks style. I think Gargano makes an amazing face to cheer on, and is truly an outstanding performer in the ring. But every match he's had starts to bleed into the other. So while this recent match could have been the best one, it felt like I had seen it before, so it didn't feel like the best. Plus, the finisher spamming which was an issue with DoN was in full effect here too, and has been too often with Takeovers. I find by the main event, I'm drained more often than not (though Gargano vs Ciampa and Gargano vs Almas were phenomenal) and don't feel the matches are as good as other reviewers have stated.

    But Riddle vs Strong was the match of the month for me.

  40. #200
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    I'm getting a bit tired of watching Gargano matches, to be honest. There was a point in time where I think I was warming to him because I felt like the 'indy' in him had been ironed out into something much more focused and he was becoming a wrestler that blended the indy stuff he did and the WWE style perfectly. But his last handful of matches, especially the Cole ones, have flipped me back to my earlier feelings on him and I now think he's doing too much in his matches and not letting them breathe properly.

    I miss Ciampa.

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