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  1. #41
    I don't know if I'm looking forward to the next year so much but will stick with a few episodes at least. Think it definitely has to get better though.

  2. #42
    Administrator Prime Time's Avatar
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    Not long now. But in other news this is something I cribbed from a story about the new Picard series, on Stewart's place in the writing room.

    "The novelist-turned-screenwriter went on to explain the exact role Stewart had in the writing process. According to Chabon, Stewart showed up for a few weeks to brainstorm with the writers to get ideas flowing.

    "That time with Patrick as a resource and as a very willing and literate resource, I think its going to make the show"

    So yeah, sounds like they are using him and his experience on TNG as a way into the character.

    "The worst moron is the one too stupid to realise they're a moron."

  3. #43
    Author of 101 WWE Matches To See Before You Die Samuel 'Plan's Avatar
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    That's a really positive sign. I dare venture all these early signs are - they seem to be approaching the project with a real reverence for the material and no clear desire to just craft something poppy and post-modern for the sake of it.

  4. #44
    Administrator Prime Time's Avatar
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    Have gone back to the beginning with TNG. Well, I say the beginning - beginning of series 3, in line with my own recommendation elsewhere in the thread.

    Watched the first two episodes, Evolution and The Ensigns of Command. The second is a great, great episode. The first shows signs of what the show will become. It feels a bit like the first two series at times, while at others it's a bit more stripped back and like what you get in most of series 4-7. Lots to like in it, though. A better Wesley episode which contains some important points in his overall narrative, and also some decent notes added to the relationship between Picard and Dr Crusher.

    Yeah, generally speaking I thought it held up remarkably well considering it's almost thirty years old now.


    To newer stuff: Discovery returns 3 weeks Friday (US) and Saturday (UK), so it's nearly here.

    "The worst moron is the one too stupid to realise they're a moron."

  5. #45
    Has anyone seen any of this yet?

  6. #46
    Administrator Prime Time's Avatar
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    I haven't yet but am looking forward to it. Do we know if it's just in the States at the moment or is this in the UK as well yet?

    "The worst moron is the one too stupid to realise they're a moron."

  7. #47
    Author of 101 WWE Matches To See Before You Die Samuel 'Plan's Avatar
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    It's available here too Prime. I watched the first episode a few days back.

    Without wanting to give anything away, it's pretty much more of what we were getting in the final few episodes of season one, in terms of the writing and production style.

  8. #48
    Administrator Prime Time's Avatar
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    Still haven't gotten around to it. Been re-watching TNG instead, haha. Carried on with seasson 3 above but also been dipping into season 1.

    The first one has some better episodes than I remembered but for the most part it really is as I imagined it. But this third season... I tell you what, this gets to be really, really good much earlier than I thought. There are some seriously smart episodes in the first half of that third series - I don't know how well they age if you come to it new but it's amongst the most philosophically sophisticated popular TV I've ever seen, and that's right at the heart of its appeal. I'd completely forgotten the episode 'The Bonding', for example, but it's got the kind of musings in it that I'm used to only really hearing in a seminar room.

    Needless to say going back to it, I just love it all the more, and am expanding my idea of it getting to be awesome even earlier.

    "The worst moron is the one too stupid to realise they're a moron."

  9. #49
    Administrator Prime Time's Avatar
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    Finally gotten around to starting Discovery. Anyone been watching? I feel like it's taken a big lurch towards being more 'Trek', but paradoxically one of the weird things about it is because it's nearer its made it easier to think about and articulate where exactly it is not quite hitting the right notes for a trekker.

    "The worst moron is the one too stupid to realise they're a moron."

  10. #50
    The Brain
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    Haven't seen Discovery, but I've been binging through Voyager with the wife! I watched it haphazardly when I was young so a lot of it's familiar, but it's fun to go back and watch it through properly. It's not the strongest Trek ever but I've got a lot of love for it, lots of good stuff going on in there. Anything with The Doctor is my jam.

  11. #51
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    Funny you say that MF, cause I was actually watching Voyager for first time last week. Got up to season 2. Its enjoyable, really like Neelix and the potential of the show but sometimes it gets bogged down by science mumbo jumbo.. Also, I really dislike Chakotay.

  12. #52
    The Brain
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    Oh dang! Chakotay is a bit bland but I never hated the guy, what's your beef with him?

  13. #53
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    I think my problem with him is he just feels like he was supposed to be the Native American rep. Its hard for me to buy him as a Maquis so you strip that away and all you've got is a bland character. I wouldn't say I hate him, I just don't feel there's a big need for him you know?

    Its also weird to go from DS9 where that show focused heavily on character and then watch Voyager like that's missing even if it can be an enjoyable show.

    Oh but like you, I really like the Doctor. They chose the perfect actor for it as well.
    Last edited by LK3185; 03-05-2019 at 03:54 PM.

  14. #54
    The Brain
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    There are definitely a few possibly cringeworthy moments surrounding his indigenous heritage. I do also agree it's a bit hard to imagine him as the leader of basically a terrorist group considering he's so disciplined and generally nonviolent, though you could argue he was the guiding/restraining hand for the more violent members of the group (Torres, Suder, Seska, etc).

    I like all the characters generally, Harry Kim is probably my least favorite. He's fine but he's very much "oh shucks, I'm the new kid", even through most of the series. He grows a little but I would have liked to see more of an arc with him.

    DS9 is forever my favorite, so yeah there's no real comparison! What I really would have liked from Voyager is to flesh out the rest of the crew more. Just for kicks on this watch through I'm keeping track of crew members outside the main group that get featured (or even mentioned) and it's a damn short list. Also, they can't stay consistent about how many crewmembers they have to save their life!

  15. #55
    Author of 101 WWE Matches To See Before You Die Samuel 'Plan's Avatar
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    Voyager is always my favourite because it was my first Trek! The show does genuinely hit a great stride around the S3-5 mark too, so try to hang on until then at the very least.

    News came out about the casting they're looking to do for the new Picard show. I won't share here for those who want to avoid having any and all knowledge, but I will say that the descriptions of the characters they're casting are extremely interesting and have made me, if anything, more excited to see how the show emerges.

  16. #56
    Administrator Prime Time's Avatar
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    Oh boy, interesting times in here. Don't have the time to do it now but I need to jump in on this voyager convo at some point because you know I have some opinions!

    Colour me intrigued on the Picard series, Plan. Do we have an idea of when they are aiming to start actually making it? Though obviously all that would be tentative AF if they're still only talking about casting.

    "The worst moron is the one too stupid to realise they're a moron."

  17. #57
    The Brain
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    Just watched the Voyager episode where the Doctor gives himself an imagination. It was by far my wife's favorite and definitely one of mine as well, I remembered it so well from my fleeting teenage watching that I could have sung the song from the cold open from memory!

  18. #58
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    I need to go through Voyager and Enterprise all again at some point, because there's a whole lot of Voyager in particular that I just don't remember very well. Haven't watched any older stuff for a while either. I think it's because I'm behind on Discovery and there's a sense that if we're going to watch some that we should watch that, but I'm just still not motivated to carry on with it. Can't see it as Trekky enough, and it just doesn't draw me in at all. There's a whole question of pacing about it that is off, for one thing. You can't speed something up that much and retain the some level of psychological complexity - it's just not possible. Art needs to be experienced and giving people the time to process complexity is an essential part of that.

    To the point above about Voyager characters, I get where you are both coming from but I lean more towards Mizfan's position. But what I thought was most noticeable is that, aside from a couple of exceptions, you can really feel the difference in them not going for theatre actors in that show, and I think the overall standard of casting is lower. Like, they got Patrick Stewart and a few of the other less famous guys as people with a lot of stage experience, and so when Stewart and Spiner in particular worked out really well they repeated the trick by getting in Avery Brooks and several others with a similar background - and pound for pound DS9 might have the strongest cast (though it's not really fair because it's also the most expansive). But I'm just not sure it's really there in Voyager, or in Enterprise for that matter. Though I do love Mulgrew and Picardo, and think Tim Russ and Ethan Phillips both do plenty to hold their own. And Jeri Ryan does well whenever they actually give her something to do beyond emotionless Borg.

    "The worst moron is the one too stupid to realise they're a moron."

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