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Thread: John Cena

  1. #1
    Member #25 SirSam's Avatar
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    John Cena

    The story is a few days old now but Cena had some interesting and not too flattering stuff to say about the WWE locker room in a recent interview:

    “I did not do well in this match. My ‘WrestleMania Moment’ was to spend the time in the crowd and not do well in a very short performance, but I loved it because it got the job done.

    The focus was not me, the focus was someone else. Often times, we look at things so selfishly, asking, ‘What’s in it for me?’ Well, what was in it for me was the chance to reintroduce a WWE icon. I had to stretch the suspension of disbelief to its breaking point to do it, but it was awesome. Every single week, the crowd would chant at the top of its lungs and no one thought I would be sitting in the crowd at WrestleMania, but I was able to do that. I was able to go out and be handily defeated in three minutes and bring back an icon.

    That is a message to any performer who is complaining about their spot or that, creatively, they have nothing going for them. I’ve been first, I’ve been in the middle, I’ve been last. I just want to go out there and do something.

    There are a few performers who share my ideology, with The Miz being one of them. That’s why he is skyrocketing into a new bracket as we speak, and I can’t wait to see what he does next week. But there is also a lot of disdain and complacency. You should be happy with any sort of role, even if it is getting your tail kicked in.”
    Of course the lines that are kicking up the most controversy are the ones about complacency however for me I feel like he has really minimised his role in the build up to Mania. With him being on. It shows almost no one got more tv time than he did in the lead up and him saying he inky got 3 minutes is so deceptive, he actually had a full segment with Elias AND the Undertaker segment then match AND all the stuff in the crowd.

    Anyway what do you guys think?

  2. #2
    Feeling Minnesota Powder's Avatar
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    Honestly, I think Cena should become the 3-4 matches a year guy. He should come back for a feud to put a guy over, and MAYBE one last title run to have him break the record.

    But IMHO, I think that Cena needs to put over the Miz at Mania before he finally retires, the Miz won at 27, but basically he was the forgotten piece with that Match being overshadowed by the Rock.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Powder View Post
    Honestly, I think Cena should become the 3-4 matches a year guy. He should come back for a feud to put a guy over, and MAYBE one last title run to have him break the record.
    I think it would be cool for Cena not to break the record, and just have it be the Cena-Flair record instead.

    But IMHO, I think that Cena needs to put over the Miz at Mania before he finally retires, the Miz won at 27, but basically he was the forgotten piece with that Match being overshadowed by the Rock.
    I don't think he *needs* to put over Miz, particularly at Mania, though it's not a bad idea. And having Cena/Rock overshadow Miz was the correct decision in 2011 in every single way, even with the full power of hindsight and Miz's current career renewal. It's also said by people that worked with Miz that he 'lost confidence' in himself after WM 27, so there's also that, he didn't have the fortitude to carry on and prove himself until many years later. Even presently, he's a great character above all, and a serviceable wrestler at best.

  4. #4
    The Brain
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    John Cena, one of the most favorably booked wrestlers of all time, says don't rock the boat! Go figure.

    I dislike the idea of Cena becoming the couple times a year guy. I'd rather they used him heavily when they have something specific for him, then let him off the rest of the time to do movies or whatever. It's worked in the past.

    He'll probably break the record, which is... fine, I guess? Doesn't feel very meaningful when I think about it, considering how different his era was from any that came before.

    Love the idea of him putting Miz over. That match did a number on Miz, possibly because of the bad concussion he got during it, so it'd be great to see that demon exorcised.

    The idea that Miz is "serviceable" as a wrestler is nuts to me, by the way. I guess from a workrate perspective he's average but he's an elite at this point in terms of crowd engagement and making every move count, which is at least as important if not more so, and something far fewer guys are able to master.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mizfan View Post

    The idea that Miz is "serviceable" as a wrestler is nuts to me, by the way. I guess from a workrate perspective he's average but he's an elite at this point in terms of crowd engagement and making every move count, which is at least as important if not more so, and something far fewer guys are able to master.
    To me, that's 'average', particularly in WWE's currently super-stacked environment of great workers. He gets the job done, usually is in place for the moves, doesn't screw things up, is dependable, and can be carried to great matches with the right person (eg, Seth Rollins), but if you take that away from him, he won't be stealing shows on his own, if he's placed with other average wrestlers or worse wrestlers, and the onus is on him to carry people.

    He's not better than say Kevin Owens/Zayn and the quirky little things they do mid-match or in their promos/entrances. Miz is also not even that great of a promo (though he is a legitimately great deliverer/actor, which is not the same thing).

  6. #6
    The Brain
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    I'd honestly rather watch a Miz match than an Owens match these days, and that's coming from a guy who likes Owens. But different takes for different people, I suppose. The statement that Miz is not a great promo doesn't even look like English to me, so I doubt we can have a meaningful discussion about it!

  7. #7
    Super Moderator Prime Time's Avatar
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    I think I preferred Miz/Ziggler in 2016 more than any main roster KO match I can remember. And if I can't remember it, I clearly didn't like it much either.

    "The worst moron is the one too stupid to realise they're a moron."

  8. #8
    Member #25 SirSam's Avatar
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    I agree with what you said there Mizfan, it is so easy for someone at the top to say 'well look how much I hustled' when the cleaner was there before you and will leave after.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mizfan View Post
    I'd honestly rather watch a Miz match than an Owens match these days, and that's coming from a guy who likes Owens. But different takes for different people, I suppose. The statement that Miz is not a great promo doesn't even look like English to me, so I doubt we can have a meaningful discussion about it!
    By that I meant, he is really good at credibly reading the script and the dialogue/verbiage that he gets, which is a real skill, since most people in the WWE come off as awful, but he isn't a master of playing/manipulating the crowd, getting them to feel, to buy into the show or tickets, off the cuff, that truly great talkers like your Dusty Rhodes, Flairs, or even John Cenas, Edges, CM Punks, and Daniel Bryans could/can do. He's just good, really good, at working with the dialogue he gets and playing his particular character. That's probably a consequence of the modern style of WWE promo, where you're taught to recite lines, whereas back in the day, you were expected to be able to be charismatic enough - on your own - to get the rubes emotionally invested into the show and the storyline to buy tickets. Miz, addition to being an actor, was brought though this system, whereas a lot of the other guys were either old timers who came through the territory system, or went through Indies which are more closer to the old territory system than WWE's 'sports entertainment' NXT system.

  10. #10
    The Brain
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    All I know is every time I watch a Miz promo, I can't wait to see what he does next. I guess maybe he doesn't have that effect on everyone but clearly he's compelling to a lot of people, considering how hugely over he is right now and how invested people are in his matches.

  11. #11
    Super Moderator Prime Time's Avatar
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    I found that famous talking smack appearance to me very much a great, classic-style promo.

    Look at me, praising not just new stuff but The Miz. 2010 me would be spitting with disbelief.

    "The worst moron is the one too stupid to realise they're a moron."

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    @mizfan,I do agree that he's very compelling, just for different reasons than you.

    I also think the Talking Smack stuff was great, and really the revival of his career; he was floundering before that.

  13. #13
    Member #25 SirSam's Avatar
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    Do we see big match John back for Summer Slam?

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    Feeling Minnesota Powder's Avatar
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    Probably not. My guess is around Survivor Series, because Bumblebee is set to come out in December.

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    I shouldn't be, but I'm somewhat awed by Cena's hustle. A few months ago he was Twittering with some K-Pop idol, and just recently he was exchanging tweets with Shah Rukh Khan. He would make a great great WWE executive some day.

  16. #16
    Member #25 SirSam's Avatar
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    He certainly seems to be one of the few men that could match Vince in the crazy work ethic department.

  17. #17
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    John Cena seems more capable, open-minded and in touch with the modern world and popular culture though. With Vince, people like Cornette have described him as being somewhat unhealthy in that wrestling is his whole life and he doesn't really know or keep track of anything else, and just spends his whole day on it and body-building I guess. I forget which article it was, but some ex-WWE writer (Freddy Prinze Jr. maybe) recalled a conversation with Vince, and somewhere during the conversation they began talking about comedy, and Vince is all like, 'why would watch other comedians, we've got our own Santino Marrella?'. The vibe that I got was, for Vince, 'why step out of the wrestling world unless you need to?' It's very hermetic and borderline obsessive. It's his whole world.

  18. #18
    The Brain
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    There's a definite wrestling bubble, and Vince is deep in it. Which is probably in part why he's successful, but obviously it's got a downside too. I'm still amused by stories like Scott Hall stealing from Scarface and Vince being amazed that he was coming up with all this stuff, because he'd never heard of the movie.

  19. #19
    Super Moderator Prime Time's Avatar
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    So when was the last time you heard anything about Cena that wasn't about his non-marriage? Seems that's all I hear of him nowadays.

    "The worst moron is the one too stupid to realise they're a moron."

  20. #20
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    I just read that Cena will be doing the voice of a villain on the new season of the Ninja Turles show coming out.

    Cena has the Bumblebee Transformers movie coming out in December.

    I also heard a rumor that he'll be back to challenge the Undertaker of all people at SummerSlam, but I highly, highly doubt it as I think they would've started that angle by now.

    My guess he will be back in 1-2 months, stick around 2 months, leave again, and come back to hype Bumblebee and appear at the Rumble and maybe face Taker again at next year's Mania. Not dissimilar to last year, if I'm not mistaken.

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