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  1. #361
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    Thought the show was close to the best of the three and one thing I liked is they used the preshow to promote via mic time a few matches for the main show and kept the comedy to a minimum. The librarian gimmick is still bad but at least the Kiss match wasn’t filled with shenanigans

    As far as main show, thought it was a tad too long but the matches delivered (especially impressed with Cima who I thought was done before this) and they set up several matches for all out. I think the biggest drawback was Adam Page had a match with Kip Sabian that did nothing to make you think he was ready for the top title

  2. #362
    The Brain
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    Definitely enjoyed Fight for the Fallen overall. Probably should have trimmed it a bit shorter, but even in the heat the crowd seemed invested right to the end.

    Updated top 10 for the singles division (as I see it...):

    10. Sammy Guevara (winning side of a 6man tag)
    9. Jungle Boy (eliminated Ace Romero in the Casino Battle Royal, non-pinfall loss in a 4way)
    8. Luchasaurus (eliminated Private Party, Jimmy Havoc, and Joey Janela in the Casino Battle Royal)
    7. MJF (winning side in a 6man tag, eliminated Brandon Cutler, Dustin Thomas, and Glacier in the Casino Battle Royal, non-pinfall loss in a 4way)
    6. Sonny Kiss (defeated Peter Avalon in a singles match)
    5. Shawn Spears (pinned Darby Allin to win a 6man tag)
    4. Cody Rhodes (defeated Dustin Rhodes, time limit draw with Darby Allin)
    3. Kenny Omega (defeated CIMA in a singles match, pinned Laredo Kid to win a 6man tag)
    2. Hangman Page (won the Casino Battle Royale, pinned Jimmy Havoc in a 4way, defeated Kip Sabian in a singles match)
    1. Chris Jericho (defeated Kenny Omega)

    I'm split with Luchasaurus, I kind of want him to continue in the tag division with Jungle Boy but he could be a great asset to the singles division too, based on how well he's done so far. Was really disappointed that Darby Allin took the pin in the six man tag, I figured Guevara was there to eat the pin when MJF and Spears blew up. Glad Page came out to fight Jericho during his promo, that did more for his standing than struggling to take down a lower level guy like Kip Sabian (nothing against him, thought he did well). Still doesn't feel like he can leap over Jericho in terms of being important to the company though.

    Looking forward to All In and already wondering who'll be the first challenger for the title. Based on what we expect from All Out, you gotta figure it'll be Omega, Moxley, and Cody depending on what big wins are picked up.

  3. #363
    Quote Originally Posted by LK3185 View Post
    Thought the show was close to the best of the three and one thing I liked is they used the preshow to promote via mic time a few matches for the main show and kept the comedy to a minimum. The librarian gimmick is still bad but at least the Kiss match wasn’t filled with shenanigans

    As far as main show, thought it was a tad too long but the matches delivered (especially impressed with Cima who I thought was done before this) and they set up several matches for all out. I think the biggest drawback was Adam Page had a match with Kip Sabian that did nothing to make you think he was ready for the top title
    This is fair critism of Sonny Kiss. Elsewhere, I read somebody complaining about his skimpy clothes and his twerking. It's 2019 for godsake. I think, unless theres something wrong with you, that you should appreciate watching your heros make it clap with their buns.
    Last edited by Benjamin Button; 1 Week Ago at 03:49 PM.

  4. #364
    Beautiful Fandom Mystic's Avatar
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    I'm torn on some of the Jim Ross stuff. He can get cranky about some of the AEW product on air, and I've heard critiques of this. That is fair enough, but there are also a lot of older fans like me who want to watch AEW but are turned off by some of the same things (for instance, how many combo death sequences can end in a 2 count? or what if I don't want to pretend that the Order are the stars of the match when Jungle Boy and LS are in it?). So, I do wonder if Jim Ross can be cranky as a representation of part of the fan base while X marks out for the same shit as representation of another part of the base. Probably not, because I would be pissed if he were being cranky about things I like, but it feels nice when it's stuff I also can't comprehend. I guess I'm trying to say it's very difficult appealing to fan bases that likely don't like each other.

  5. #365
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    I thought it was an extremely average Indy show with a bigger budget, which has been my thought for every AEW show. I think AEW is in for a rude awakening when ratings are a factor, because they keep playing to the same crowd.

    I haven't finished Extreme Rules yet, but it's already a far superior show in terms of variety, story telling, and fun. Workrate, AEW wins hands down. But I can get workrate on Impact, ROH, WWE, NJPW, and MLW. I want a reason to care for the great workrate matches, and AEW gives me JR, Marvez, self indulgent EVPs booking their matches in HHHesque fake epics (with 10 fold amount of illogical spots), and a bunch of insane moves that should end matches but aren't finishers. Black VS Cesaro was better than anything I saw on any AEW show.

    I get that we are sharing opinions, and I'm apparently in the minority on this subject. I think AEW is playing to a lot of the preferences shared here, which I understand, and don't blame you for. But big picture, this is going to become very boring very quickly if they don't switch it up a bit more. All the things most AEW fans complain about from WWE, tend to praise on AEW. I guess it's the fact that there's an energy and a fresh feeling to it all. An excitement that AEW truly will be different. But I'm not seeing it yet.

    Positives, the arena was phenomenal to watch a show from, I love the ramp, wins and losses are still a major factor, Riho and Bea, time limits (though they might need a better way to display them then the Justin Roberts interruptions) and Dustin Fucking Rhodes.

  6. #366
    Beautiful Fandom Mystic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PEN15v2 View Post
    Workrate, AEW wins hands down. But I can get workrate on Impact, ROH, WWE, NJPW, and MLW. I want a reason to care for the great workrate matches, and AEW gives me JR, Marvez, self indulgent EVPs booking their matches in HHHesque fake epics (with 10 fold amount of illogical spots), and a bunch of insane moves that should end matches but aren't finishers.
    I have been nothing but a supporter of AEW and I haven't enjoyed WWE in twenty years, yet I have said that nothing has made me more sympathetic to WWE in twenty years than some moments of watching AEW. There is no more problematic formula than to bash WWE in ways that make sense only to go out there and deliver a product that makes WWE look superior. I have also said the biggest mistake they made is coming out arrogant so early (Cody with the throne, every word out of the YB mouths). In reverse, if you just come out hungry and humble, people would be more inclined to lift you up. (Hard to lift up a company when it's steady lifting itself up.) I love Cody. I love his vision (most of the time and almost always in theory). I like a lot of what Tony Khan thinks. I liked the arena and the ramp a lot. I like that wins and losses matter.

    But then there is the execution...

    On a lot of the shows, you can't even get a damn promo or storyline in the match because "sports centric" but you can get three matches that are comedy based that make 0 sense from a "sports centric" POV. You can't even get a damn promo or storyline because "sports centric" but you can get a million flips and no psychology. I would think "sports centric" would often mean an ELEVATION of story and promos, not necessarily overdoing it, but that every moment would be heightened because it all matters.

    Currently, I like about 3/4 of the women's division. Awesome Kong/Aja Kong gives me lovely expectations. I like a portion of the tag division, but I also notice it's not the ones winning matches that I'm most excited about. I like most of what Cody's done, minus the throne and the Young Bucks stuff.

    I'm honestly getting to the point that I wish Tony Khan started this with Cody, and that'd they'd keep WWE out of their mouths. Wish the Young Bucks would have signed with WWE or will get mad one day and go back to where they came from. I personally found them arrogant in the main event, behaving like wrestling a match in any way aside from their style was easy and boring, and always winning every fucking thing they do while being obnoxious while doing it.

    I also like: MJF, Luchasaurus, Jungle Boy.

    But if I gave you the list of who and what I don't like, the balance is getting unhealthy.

    Still watching, still semi-enjoying, but if they don't change their attitude and their style a bit on weekly TV they will, at best, have me as a casual viewer.
    Last edited by Mystic; 1 Week Ago at 06:55 AM.

  7. #367
    Super Moderator Team Farrell's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PEN15v2 View Post
    I thought it was an extremely average Indy show with a bigger budget, which has been my thought for every AEW show. I think AEW is in for a rude awakening when ratings are a factor, because they keep playing to the same crowd.

    I haven't finished Extreme Rules yet, but it's already a far superior show in terms of variety, story telling, and fun. Workrate, AEW wins hands down. But I can get workrate on Impact, ROH, WWE, NJPW, and MLW. I want a reason to care for the great workrate matches, and AEW gives me JR, Marvez, self indulgent EVPs booking their matches in HHHesque fake epics (with 10 fold amount of illogical spots), and a bunch of insane moves that should end matches but aren't finishers. Black VS Cesaro was better than anything I saw on any AEW show.

    I get that we are sharing opinions, and I'm apparently in the minority on this subject. I think AEW is playing to a lot of the preferences shared here, which I understand, and don't blame you for. But big picture, this is going to become very boring very quickly if they don't switch it up a bit more. All the things most AEW fans complain about from WWE, tend to praise on AEW. I guess it's the fact that there's an energy and a fresh feeling to it all. An excitement that AEW truly will be different. But I'm not seeing it yet.

    Positives, the arena was phenomenal to watch a show from, I love the ramp, wins and losses are still a major factor, Riho and Bea, time limits (though they might need a better way to display them then the Justin Roberts interruptions) and Dustin Fucking Rhodes.
    I don't think that I could agree with much of this more.

    I was on the road Saturday night, so yesterday in between enjoying the sun and running errands, I picked at the Evolve show (I'm sure you can find my thoughts on that card elsewhere) and then opted to watch Fight for the Fallen instead of Extreme Rules last night.

    I didn't hate the show (though I skipped the Buy In entirely) but I saw a lot of individual stuff that I did.

    Someone needs to tell the CBO to stay the fuck out of the ring. It was angering to watch a competent wrestler try and carry her through a match. It's one thing when it's Shane McMahon and it's a little annoying, but that guy is clearly a natural athlete and isn't wincing and obviously afraid to bump. You can take a bump safely, so be a manager for Kong who can work tags and get yours from time to time. That match made me angry.

    The bunch of insane moves that should be finishers is indy as fuck. It was all over Evolve, and all of this show. I yelled at my TV when Luchasaurus and Jungle Boy did one huge double team finisher transitioned into a second massive double team finishing move, only to have the pin broken up. At some point it hits the level of absurdity.

    The skinny Dark Order guy is pretty good. I didn't much care for the other one who seemed to struggle to get the vertical leap to jump over a leg sweep in his opening spot. I didn't need that triple threat at all, and if Dark Order is the team that you want to push for some reason give them a squash match, seriously. You needed them there to do the set-up for Jericho, so just have them hit all of their big moves on some team fresh out of training camp.

    The whole show just felt so self indulgent. I've said it before, but it feels like a show run by (and featuring) every "super clever" independent wrestler that I know if nobody ever told them that their "awesome" ideas were shit.

    That said, Adam Page and MJF are stars. I couldn't have liked MJF any less at All In -- I thought that he looked so out of his depth that he shouldn't have been on the card -- and I couldn't have changed my opinion more. I loved Page's match from start to finish. I liked it because a) I said out loud at one point "look, they're having a serious pro wrestling match" and b) because it was a win for Page that was on the card to show off the state that his knee is in seven weeks out from his big match. It was just a nice reminder that the injury they want to get over is there, it's got him a little off his game and he'll still pull out all the stops but doing so might cost him.

    I liked JR on the show. I know a lot of people did not. Calling Jungle Boy (another future star) Jack Perry and not acting like people don't know who he is, is a good thing in my view. Him doing little things like when Marves speculated that an injured Page could have turned down the match only for JR to correct him and tell him that if he turned down the match, the "championship committee" would have moved on to the next guy in line was great. I can appreciate that he isn't just going to be all sunshine and roses about everything if he doesn't like it.

  8. #368
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    I'm most bothered by the comments made by Cody and Tony after the show. Cody talking about how all matches should be long is really ignorant. His "counter programming" comment was ridiculous. Tony stating how this show is closer to what they have in mind for TV really bummed me out.

    It's weird, I know I'm negative. I like the shows. All of them. But they aren't special in the way they are hyped up to be. And there's a lot of weak parts that seem to be downplayed by the fans, but stand out glaringly to me. I don't see what makes AEW better than Impact or ROH yet. It's a new company so they need to iron out their own details, and their TV might be completely different than what I'm expecting. But the excitement I had after Fyter Fest is gone, and it's already in the category of my ROH/Impact viewing that I always watch behind without all that much excitement (no "MUST WATCH LIVE" feeling for those brands either).

  9. #369
    La Parka should confront Spears on a future show. There's only one Chairman.

  10. #370
    Gotta say I enjoyed the show, overall. Watched the six man and the triple threat tag twice...Like the characters, especailly MJF and Darby. Not digging Spears, yet. Seems the chair shot is all he has going for him. It was a nice story to give their rilvary but dont think he has what it takes to build on it. We'll see. Thought Luchasouras and Jungle Boy looked great.

  11. #371
    I agree about Spears. He's not young, he's only been over by shouting '10', and there's really nothing special about him.

  12. #372

  13. #373
    Quote Originally Posted by Team Farrell View Post
    Almost like he's a "good hand".
    Watch your head, saying things like that. He's pretty sloppy with his chair shots, too.

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